Diamond Strategies to Change Your Drinking with Michael Diamond

Michael Diamond and Alcohol Tipping Point-20230331_100157-Meeting Recording Welcome to another episode of alcohol to being pointed podcast. This one, we really hit the ground running. I didn't get a chance to do a regular intro for Mike diamond. So I'm going to do it here. Mike diamond is an author, television personality director, life, coach, and interventionists. He's best known for his work on the TV shows, New York ink and Bondai ink tattoo crew. Mike got sober in April. , 16th of 2006. And since then, my cousin literally helped hundreds of people on the road to recovery. He is the author of seven steps to an unbreakable mindset and the newly released book, a dose of positivity tools, techniques, and strategies to live life on your own terms. I hope you enjoy this episode. Like I said, Mike diamond, just arts out on fire. Mike diamond drops gems. So. Enjoy this episode, we talk about a lot of different things. We talk about finding your purpose. He gives some specific techniques that you can use. When you're having cravings, we talk about dealing with setbacks. And, and he just kind of shares about his life and he has so much to share. So enjoy this episode. Deb: In this world where we're like changing our drinking or we're trying to get sober and we're done with it, you see the same thing where it, it gets divided into like these different tribes and like, no, you have to do it this way. You're not doing it right. That's so disempowering, like you said. Mike: Well, the reason as well that I don't agree with that is this. So I don't if I meet you right now, right? I don't know you. I don't know where you've come from. I don't know what you've experienced. I don't know your envi environment. I don't know how that environment affected you. Right? And I don't know where you've come to, into this place, right? So what I do, right? Because no one gave me this information. I was mentally, physically abused most of my life, right? Because my parents didn't have the skills, right? They just weren't taught the skills. This, there was tools out there, but back then, You know when I went to school, if you didn't pay attention, you got, you got cracked, people hit you. I got the cane, I got the strap. Right? Then you don't go to your parents, Hey, I got hit. Cuz you get a double hitting cuz like, what did you do wrong? Right? So then you go to the extreme. Now if a kid, it's o oversensitive, right? But there's a middle ground because we, it was this corporal punishment for everything. So when I meet someone, I just shut up and I actively listen and I just meet them where they're at and they're going to have different, they have to have different opinions to me and perspectives. And I'll tell you why. I always say to people, the food isn't the menu, right? You could look at a menu, but until you try the food, you get the taste. So the map isn't the territory. You can look at a map of the world, but it's not the actual territory. So I don't know the territory you've experienced and I don't know your map of reality. I can't, cuz I'm not you. You have to have a different perspective to me. So if I get outta my own way, right, and get, go into second person, which is you, and just look at the world the way you look at it, in a very unconditional, loving, non-judgment, mental way. I can get along pretty well anywhere in the world. I don't have to agree with all your opinions, right? And if you are a good kind person and compassion empathetic, making empowering choices and bringing value to others, it's fine. Now, if you're a racist, bigot, homophobic, mean, destructive human being, I, I might step in and say, Hey, have you, have you tried another way? Because when you are in pain, all you push out is pain, right? So the person's just in pain. They need help. They need healing. They're hurt, they're suffering. And then no one's probably slowed them down and given them tools, right? So I just say to people, wherever you're at, I'll meet you there. And then I just separate toxic people. I just step back. If someone's toxic and they're spitting venom, I'm just like, honey, I just don't need to deal with it. I'm gonna be angry or just not so, so I don't try to change people's opinions. If someone's rock bottom falling apart and they're like, I had a friend of mine used to drink 70 drinks a week, right? 70. It's an old roommate. I get sober bad and he's like, I read the worst article in my life. I said, what was it about? He goes, they said If you drink more than 30 drinks a week, you're an alcoholic. And I'm like, well, you're probably drinking a alcoholically, cuz it's like five or six a night. He's like, I'm drinking 70 a week. I was like, you, you got an issue? No, I don't. Okay, okay. I got him sober five times. He's still to this day, Get sober, messes his life up, get sober, messes up. He won't stop. He can't drink. Moderately. I can't stop him. I'm still loving. I'm still kind. It's just, I can't, I'm 17 years sober, right? He doesn't look at me and go, maybe Mike's got an no. Just, okay. That's where he is at. I'm still kind and loving. I can't change him. You know? We've gotta stop trying to change people. It doesn't work like that. It's not, it's not. Deb: Yeah, I, I, I, and you just really showed that in, in your book. So I, I was telling you before we started recording, like I was just so delighted to get this newest book. You wrote A dose of positivity Tools, techniques, and strategies to live your life on your own terms, because it is just full of these nuggets, like what you were just talking about and just full of so many useful ways to compassionately live your life on your own terms, you know, and, and what might work for someone might not work for someone else. And, and that's okay. And to let go of that judgment. Mike: Yeah. We've gotta stop telling people what to do. Just gotta like, look, it's like I say to people, I got sober in a 12 step meeting. I, I walked into a meeting cuz I was making horrible choice. I talk about it when I, when I, when I, it. Was with Scott Wyland in the book, right? Making disastrous choices, right? I climbed the wrong mountain here. It was all superficially. You think I've got it together? I'm, I'm a disaster. I break my ankle before I'm shooting the VH1 pilot. I'm a disaster, right? No one, no one intervened. No one said, Hey Mike, what are you doing? Because that's what I, that was the company. I had work hard, play hard. So I was like, I'll go to meetings, went to meetings. I shut my mouth. It clicked. I just knew, I, I had learnt my lesson from drinking and cocaine and the heroin, whatever. I, I was, that to me, I was mood altering cuz of the pain, cuz of the trauma when I'm triggered. I had no tools when the trauma came up. What, what is safe and guaranteed. Cocaine, alcohol. So it works for a while. Because that's all you have, right? And then the insidious thing about drugs and alcohol and disempowering choices that we make that are short term, the long term consequences are disastrous, but we're so caught into it. Get stuck in the rabbit hole. And I tell people it becomes an unconscious competence, right? It's like when you first get into a car, it's impossible to remember everything. How am I gonna break and look through the rear vision mirror? And when I indicate, look over my shoulder in blind spots, and then all of a sudden you learn how to do it conscious competence. You go six exits down the freeway and you don't even know you're in your car. You're like, where was my mind? The body takes over, right? So the body becomes the mind. And what people don't realize is, let's just say you're driving down the freeway and someone cuts you off your amygdala, the primitive part of your brain hijacks you. And the body takes over. The emotions take over. And that's why people say, well, I was so emotional, I didn't think it's true because you are hijacked by emotions that you weren't rationally thinking, right? So when you are stuck in trauma in cycles and you are triggered, you've become an unconscious competence to go to the nearest thing, to alter the mood, which is, for me it was cocaine and drinking. I didn't rationally think, I wasn't thinking I was caught in fight, flight, freeze, and feed mode. So I just fed and fed and fed, then fought and fought and fought, right? And I was in that cycle. Until you, you sit a, like I always say, you have to disconnect to reconnect, right? Disconnect from the world, to reconnect to your source. You gotta shut it down. And then when you get reconnect, you get into your intuition. And I had that, you know, spiritual epiphany with Scott and I was like, oh, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. This is, I'm gone. I'm, I'm on the wrong path. This, I don't know where this is gonna go with my sobriety, but I know this is a mistake. And, and just everyone has it different. That's why intervene. Some people are so caught in the system. I don't expect to come an interventionist. That was the last thing on my mind. I was at acting school, like, and help people. If someone would've had a Christopher and told me that, I'm like, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. It was all me, me, me, me, me. Now it's, how do I help people? Deb: Well, I've, I mean, you have so much in your book that you can share. I, I didn't even know. I'm like, where to start, but I, I, I think this will be a helpful podcast for people just, you know, to share some of the tools that you talked about and, okay. Two of them that came up again and again were the stop. And the stamp. Can you walk us through those? They're Mike: the best. They're life changing. So stop is basically, whenever you're hijacked, whenever the emotions the amygdala takes over, you just simply just stop. You have to do you, first of all, you, you have to recognize you're, you're getting triggered. You're disturbed. You're about to fly off the handle and you stop. The second thing is take a breath and I explain to people, you have to breathe Diaphragmatically. Here we go. Yeah, yeah. I'm like, that's not breathing. That's hyperventilating. So breathing Diaphragmatically is inhaling correctly through the nose, expanding the diaphragm and then out. So some people follow cuz the Navy Seals, everyone's like wanna be cool Navy Seal. They do the box breeding, which is in for four hold for four out for four, hold for four, like a box. Right? But I tell people, and I explain the book. Like if you see a UFC fight or you see a boxing match and there's two athletes fighting, if they make it to the corner, all the corner man says, first is breathe. Breathe. You can hear. I tell people, watch a fight. And they're like, you're right. I go, because the corner man knows that they're in motion, they're in fight, flood or freeze. They're in a li a fight. People think it's, you know, it's not fi it's fighting, it's boxing or ufc. But if they breathe, the blood goes out of the hands and, and the, the cardiovascular system slows down and then they're in their prefrontal cortex so they can think, so, stop, take a breath. At least five or six deep breaths. Oh, observe. You're either afraid you're not gonna give what you want, you're gonna lose what you have. You're tripping and obsessed about the future, or you have guilt and shame for something you've done in the past has to be one of the four in life. It says you're in one of those four places. Guess where you're not present? Cuz in all reality, if there's no danger right now, I'm on a podcast with you. That's it. That's the purest reality, right? It doesn't matter what happened 10 minutes ago. I don't know what's gonna happen in 10 minutes from now. I'm sitting on the podcast. So when you ground yourself and you observe from breath work, you now start to rationally think, well what is the trigger? What is the issue? And that creates the gap between information in and information out. You don't react. You've just created that simple gap. And then P proceed. You stop, you take a breath, you observe and you proceed. That's for emotion disturbance cuz the environment. Cuz remember, you can feel, act, and then think something triggers you. You have a feeling act. Then you're like, what did I do right? That stops that. Now if you're sitting there and you're in here all day, think, feel an act, that's rumination, right? I have a thought, I hate that person. I've got a resentment. That's gonna make you feel angry and resentful, and then you're gonna lash out. It's different to feeling, acting and thinking. It's thinking, right? Feeling and acting. Do you follow me? So if you sit here all day and you have a resentment, the resentment is going to trigger the negative feeling, right? Which is gonna lead into the action. But you thought your way into feeling, you didn't feel your way into thinking. Do you understand what I'm saying? It's tricky, but it may. Do you understand Deb: it? Yeah. Well, and I kind of, it, it's interesting that you bring this up because I've been hearing it or even applying it more of the think, feel, act. So yes. So, so something happens, it's a circumstance, data proven in a court a lot, right? And then you have a thought about it quickly and that thought causes your feeling. And then from there you act so, so sometimes your thoughts. Oh yeah, go ahead. Mike: No, go, Deb: go. Sometimes your thought, oh, I was just gonna say, so sometimes your automatic thought is, oh, I'm a loser, or I'm a failure, or I fucked up, or whatever. And so it's like, okay, how can we change that thought so that we have a better feeling? Mike: There you go. So that's stamp. So you're gonna stamp on the rumination and negative thoughts again, you stop. You always take your breaths, right? So once you start breathing again, you're back in control, right? Cause I'm breathing to slow my mind down. We're breathing. You were slowing your emotions down before and stop. And now a adjust my thinking. Mm-hmm. Cause now, alright, I need to adjust my thinking, right? I need to adjust it. What is this craziness, right? Am I really a loser? What am I overthinking? Why am I ruminating? Now here's the key. M is make the change. Right to find something to be grateful for in the moment. Because if you can make the change to have a little gratitude and scenting yourself, you can't have gratitude and anger. You can't be grateful for the small stuff and be angry. Gratitude changes everything. Appreciation and gratitude to see you make the change. I'm gonna make the change now to be present. Find something to be grateful for. Be kind to myself, but I'm physically gonna tell myself, adjust my thinking, make the change. Now, p I proceed, but I have to clear myself out before I make to, before I proceed. And these are like, oh, I'm gonna stamp snap stamp. I just don't feel good. Like it doesn't work like that. Stop pre diaphragmatically. Seriously. Getting, people don't, we don't breathe. We live in a world right now where no one breathes. Right. It's like I said to someone the other day, right? They're like, I go to yoga, I meditate, I eat organic foods, and they told me all the great things they do. I go, that's awesome. I said, but do you know your biggest problem? They're like, what? I'm like, you're always stressed out. I'm like, what do you mean? I said, how quickly do you move through yoga? Like I race through yoga. I'm always stressed before I get there. I'm stressed to read class. My mind isn't there. I'm like, are you really doing yoga? You're doing sport. You're not doing yoga. I go, when you eat, you read all these organic foods. I said, but are you sitting there mindfully and chew, chewing your food food slowly to build up a digestive enzymes in your saliva that then go into your gut? And remember, 80% of our serotonin, the feel good hormone is in our gut, right? And the microbile. Well, how are you eating? Well, I'm just scoffing down my food. I said, so it doesn't matter if it's organic or it's McDonald's, you're not processing the food. Food is fuel, right? That's why. What do we do? We overeat in this country, right? We get these like it's always sugar. It's because why? Because emotionally I'm not slowing down. That's why stop and stamp, slow you down, make you regulate. So what do you do? You get out of fight, flight and freeze, and you get into your sympathetic, into your parasympathetic nervous system, which is rest and digest. So if you're resting and digesting, you're healing, okay? You're not running on adrenaline. And that's what we do now cuz we can't process all the information coming in. It's too much information. So what do we do? Look, I said to someone the other day, I said, you know, the best thing about when I grew up? I said, what? I said, if I called someone and said, I'll meet you for lunch. I didn't, I, I met them. If they show they didn't show up, I go, oh. I dunno what happened. I hope they're okay. I go home, I'll find a pain phone, call them on their landline. Cause you don't really have cell phones or use them. Oh man, sorry. This went, okay, we'll see you next week. It wasn't like play by play every nine seconds. Where are you? Why are you late? What's this going on? A thousand email, a thousand text messages. I made my way to meet them. Or when I moved to New York, you know how I got to know people? I went out and met them. I didn't swipe right in an app. I didn't look for Australians in New York. There wasn't Facebook. It was barely the internet. I just met people, got to know them. How you doing? What do you like? What do you don't like? Oh, I don't like that bird. I did have a good, do you know what I'm saying? So it's like we forget that the connection, the organic connection. But if we can slow down and regulate, we can connect again. Mm-hmm. Deb: Yeah. So. So stop and stand and. Yep. Yep. Very useful. What, you know, because this is an episode about like people who are changing their drinking or quitting drinking, they have a lot of cravings. Like, are there some examples or tools that you would recommend for those kind of cravings or urges? Mike: So if do, are you talking about someone that wants to moderate or just stop, let's Deb: say stop, or they're taking a break, they're like, I don't wanna drink tonight, but every night around five o'clock I'm drinking again. Like, what are your tips for those Mike: best technique? You don't stop, you substitute. Mm-hmm. Always substitute. Right? So there's a reason why you, you crave the drink. Okay. It's very simple. Whenever we crave something, like I talk a dose of positivity, dopamine, oxytocin, serotonin, endorphins, we're looking for a dose, we're looking for the happy brain chemicals, right? But you're not also ha or you're not always have to be happy and always. You know, you can't always be happy and up when I on fire today, supposed to always be on fire. That's the human condition. That's why we're always chasing something outside ourselves to please ourselves. Sometimes it's okay to be melancholy. Sometimes it's okay to feel flat. Sometimes it's okay to be tired. The body's telling you rest. So when you craving, you're either craving a dopamine, a reward, your serotonin, endorphins, or oxytocin, right? So if you go to drinking right or go to sugar, like something like that, I go, well, what is a more empowering alternative? So for me, if I crave wine or something, I go to something like a a, a sparkling SELs of water, right? I go to something that I know is gonna sparkling SELs of water. Flavored SELs of water is the greatest. You know why? Cuz it make it tastes good. Bubbly. It's fruity. That's why. Now do you notice they have all those non-alcoholic beverages, wines, and beers? It's amazing. Those things are gold. If you are a non-alcoholic, get those non-alcoholic beverages. They are gold. They are so good tho. I, I couldn't believe they have whiskeys and a non-alcoholic. It's brilliant. It really is. Because the flavor, it's like a placebo effect. I can have a non-alcoholic beer cuz I like the taste of beer. Like 0% Heineken. And it's like I'm having a beer because I like the, I used to like the taste of, I used to like the taste of liquor. I like to get drunk, but I like the taste of it. But my wife drinks, she's a normie and she doesn't like the taste of liquor. She just has fun. Like, I like it. So I say to people, don't quit. Substitute. Don't put in your brain, I gotta quit. No, no, no, no, no. Just substitute. I'm craving now. What's my alternative? Okay, what, what can I do? So come up with real, have a nice non-alcoholic wine. If you're not, you know, that's your thing. Drink some, sell some water. Maybe eat something really healthy. Don't go to sugars. Don't like eat like a loaf of bread, cuz you're gonna still be craving, you know? Or maybe go for a walk, go for a nice walk, move your body a little bit. But always ask yourself, why, what's my craving? Why? And why am I craving it? Because we all, whatever the tr, there's something triggering it. There's always something that's motivating it. We want the carrot. There's something, what's the motivation? Why am I craving this? Wow, I'm angry. Why am I angry? I remember what my sister said, you know, and, and she annoyed me. Or, you know, I'm worried, I'm worried about the, the work, right? So I, I, I'm so freaked out that I got, I've got this deadline. Okay, so will that help me drinking the liquor? No. Okay, so, What do I, how can I take action? What can I do so I less worry, take action towards the goal. Okay. Create a solution and then do something healthy for myself. If I don't wanna drink, I've made the choice that I want to put this, I'm craving it. I know the emotion. Okay, let me do something positive and keep it simple. Deb: Yeah. I'd like how you, you did just keep it simple. You're like, don't stop substitute, no Mike: substitute. You gotta, cuz then you, you beat yourself up. I never tell people, don't beat yourself up. Stop. Just substitute. Just, just, well that, just switch it Deb: up. Yeah. That, I mean, cuz that was my other question. Like how, how do you deal with setbacks? You know, if someone is like, yeah, I'm done with drinking, but I just, you know, they're, they get stuck in that shame and sh shame and blame spiral and, and you know, they're like, I only got five days, or I keep starting over. Like, how do you deal with setbacks? Mike: Well, every obstacle's an opportunity to grow. A setback is a step forward. So we failed forward. We never failed back, right? So if you make a mistake, you've gotta identify why you made the choice. See, I'm the opposite of most like people that kind of like, they're overreached like a a n stuff. It's not stop, stop, stop. It just, let's just figure out why you're upset and be kind to yourself. The world's gonna beat you up enough. Don't sit there in your inner critic calling yourself a loser. You're not a loser. You made a choice and now you realize it wasn't the choice that deep down was empowering, right? So you were triggered, or you're upset or you're emotional. And a lot of people don't have people to talk to. So if you don't have someone you can lean on and say, Hey, I'm going through it, son, I'm going struggling, I've got a lot of fears, then what do you do? You resort to what's safe. There's a guarantee with drugs and alcohol and sex and porn and shopping. That's why it's created neuroscience marketing. They know what they did. I talk about it in the book, you know what I'm saying? When you go to like stores with the dopamine receptors, they smell a certain way. They're trick us. So first of all, be kind to yourself. All right? Identify why. Why did I slip up? Why? Right. Well, I slipped up cuz I was saying it's always an emotion, it's always a feeling. It's always a frustration. It's always a resentment. A dis you, you don't. Now some people are the opposite. They get too, too adrenaline, run too high, too happy. You know, they live in the wind too long. Like we just so remember, you, you, you drink when you're happy. You drink when you're sad. So you gotta like, but the key to this at any time if you want to stop, is to first of all just say to yourself, okay, I fell off. I had five days. Now maybe I have to check in with someone when I feel like using Right? Read something positive. Move my body, go to a yoga class. Don't, don't, don't go to the gym for six hours. You know, go for like 10, 20 minutes. Do something where it's says always go to substitute, but get out of that. Beat yourself up. It, it's, it's pointless. Everyone slips up. No one has it figured out. We're figuring it out. No one, anyone that says they know it all has already lost. No one knows it all. We just learn and grow daily. That's all we do, you know, day by day. Deb: Yeah. I, I appreciate that. Like, it, it's like, again, I wanna take a deep breath and just be like, okay, let that go. Like, I mean, just be kind to yourself and compassionate to yourself. You're so right. I mean, the world's gonna beat us up enough. We don't need to add to Mike: that. Yeah. I just, like, I, I all my life, see the reason I'm so kind to people is cuz no one was kind of me growing up. They weren't, they were mean, they bullied me. I was really successful at sports. People hated on me, wanted to see me lose. And then when I won, they called me a show off. I was damned if I do, damned if I don't, right? So no one sat me down and, and I had so much potential, but no one sat me down and showed me how to reach my potential. They didn't care. And so then when I started to realize, I gathered enough information and test myself, I said, Hey, wait a second. I was putting people on a pedestal. Everyone's figuring out like a lot of these people, I paid the dummy tax, I put myself, I left Perth, I took risks. I went to New York. I've been all over the world. I've shot TV shows, write books. I'm like, oh wow. Hey, hey, hey. No, no, no. I've seen billionaires that you think would have it all figured out and they can't stop using. So it was like, ah, it's okay. I'm just hu having a human experience like them. So that's why I'm so loving the people like, don't worry, don't dink, don't look people's people post that three or four seconds on Instagram. Right? And people go, oh, and that's their life. I'm like, do not look at the highlight clips of someone's life. When I started talking about my, how much of a crackhead I was, how many mistakes I made, and all this stuff years ago, people are like, don't do that. You'll never work. Now I'm booked everywhere as a speaker because I'm honest. Yeah. I fail more than anyone. I, I am legendary and failing. I, I have like, people go, how come you're so successful? I'm like, cause I fail so much. I break so many dishes. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, I, people look at the, the picture on the wall, the canvas in the art gallery. Don't see the mess it took to get there. You're supposed to make a mess. Life is messy. People are messy. And you just go, eh. And you just learn. You're like, oh, I won't do that. It's like falling off the bike. Eventually, if you keep going, you'll be able to kick the training wheels off. That's what life is just, and you get better at some things and some things that you, you struggle. And that's what it is. It's that human experience. You just chug along Deb: Beau. Beautifully said. Well, and you have done so much. I, I didn't read your intro. Usually I do that with you, but I'm like, wow. I mean also, so, so Mike, you're listed as an author, a television personality, a director, a life coach, an interventionist. You've been on New York Ink, Bondi Ink, tattoo Crew. You've had multiple businesses. You've, you've been in teaching the kids in a rehab facility. You're doing celebrity interventions now, like so, so, so much. And. At first, I was like, how? But then you share in the book, like you get up at four in the morning every morning. Four in the morning. Yeah. Three or four in the morning. Tell me about that. You know what's, Mike: this is the best. This is the best. So I talk about direct and indirect mentor, right? In the book, a direct mentor is calling me personally. An indirect mentor is watching someone's life and directly being infected and inspired, right? So I try to do both. I try to inspire people by action, right? And motivate them in education by what I do. But then if someone comes to me, I allow them to model my behavior and I show them how to do things right? So I always do this. If I don't know, I go to someone that knows and I don't question it. That's how I'm got good sobriety. I went to people that had 15 years of sobriety and I didn't question it. I wanted their sobriety. And then when I studied neurolinguistic programming and got CERT certified N L P, Tony Robbins talks about it, model excellence and you'll be excellent. Keep it that simple, right? So I called a friend of mine and I said, what's something? She has two kids. She's, she's a very dear friend, very successful. I said, what's something your husband could have done when you had your first kid? Cause we only wanted one kid. And she's like, if my husband would've taken the baby from three in the morning till seven in the morning and let me sleep, my life would've been, I said, done. So literally the next day I was getting up at five ish, right? I said to my wife, I'm gonna start up getting up between three and four. And she's like, why? And I said, I just, I just, I gotta do it. So I get up between three and four and just meditate, do my thing. And guess what? The baby came seven weeks premature. So we were in the I C U, right? He was in the nicu, right? But I was ready. I had train. So what I would do is when she'd do that feeding it, she'd feed him at like 12. I don't, I get to bed by eight or nine and I'm like, three o'clock I got the baby. Don't even worry about. So at three o'clock, I would grab the baby, let her sleep. I would just work out with the baby. I'd put him on like a workout thing. I'd do pull-ups with him. I'd go running. That's how I started running marathons. I'd throw the baby in the stroller and I would just spend that time and I would wait. I'd push, I'd probably push the baby five, 10,000 miles, like running uphills. People used to laugh because in the area, people go, there's this crazy guy that runs with his baby, like at three, four in the morning, right? And they would see me like running up hills with the baby. But the great thing was I wouldn't come home until she text me. So I would take food bottles, a diaper if I had to in the stroller. I, one day I pushed him like 17 miles and I would just feed him, stop bond with him, right? And then she would say, oh, babes, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm awake. So it'd be like seven 30. I come home. She had three and a half, four hour sleep. Never mess with me. Our marriage was good. Because it's like she had all, so I would get up first, yet I, and I would meditate. I would put him in like the bouncer. I would meditate, I would stretch, work out, we'd go running. It was the best. I adjusted my whole life. And now it gets me such an edge because between three and four, if I'm up by seven o'clock, I don't check my phone. No one's bothering me. If you have to use the bathroom at three in the morning, you ain't calling me. So that means no one's gonna bother me. And I've done such great deals because if there's business in New York, guess what? If I call you and it's three or four in the morning and I wanna do a deal with you, and you look at your time, you're like, damn, he's up. You beat me to the office. I wanna, and that's how I get work as well. And it's how I write my books. It's quiet, bothers me. I can sit down for hours. So between three and four to me is the golden hour. And I, I never break off. I've been doing that for like six years now. Deb: Wow. Well, as you were telling your story, first I was thinking all the moms, all the new moms, all the mom. My kids are 13 and 16 now. I was like, oh my God, Mike: it save your marriage. That's what I wanted. I, it's so it saved your marriage. It does. Like, it's so great. It's like all these mothers girls, my wife, like the, the girls, and I'm in great shape, right? And some of these guys aren't in the shape I'm in, and they're just like, we hate you. I said, why not? I was gonna say, sit up between three and four and you push the baby in a stroller. I'm like, yeah, but she leaves me alone. Now I have a great marriage. She doesn't, doesn't bother me because she's like, how can I bother him? He was up at the pool with the baby every day, never at every once. I didn't even question it. I was like, let me grab the babies, get your sleep because you need that sleep. I don't know what it's like carrying a baby. It's hard. And she didn't have postpartum. She felt great because she just knew she could get those four hours. She was never sleep deprived. So I just, I always go to someone that knows more than me and I shut up and I do the work. I'm like, done. That's all I need. And we laugh about it. Deb: Well, we, I mean, and you keep hearing about a lot of successful people get up super early. What I was gonna share too is the other morning I woke up at four 30 and I thought of you, I, I just woke up naturally and I was like, I'm gonna get up. What would Mike Diamond do? Okay, I'm gonna get up. Mike: Well, you know what it is? It just, I don't know. Like it gives me so much time. I'm in such a great state cuz I've meditated and I, we don't give ourselves enough time. Like I journal, I meditate, my body's clear. Like I'm so present when, by the time my wife gets up at seven. With my son. I'm just clear, like I can, I, I don't, I haven't checked my, I'm like clear. So whatever they need, I'm present. I'm not like getting up at six and then going, oh my God, I've got 50 things to do and I've got no time. So to me, time is everything cuz we only get 24 hours, we get the same 24 hours and then people waste a lot of time then I don't waste it. Like I always say to people, here's a trick and I talk about prioritizing your time in the book. So I say that that break the rules cuz they're meant to be broken. Respect manmade laws. Because if you don't, every law is different in every state. You could end up in jail, right? And you'd be behind the wrong bars in that situation. Right? And abide the spiritual laws. Karma and I talk about it, you know, law of correspondence cause and effect Law of purpose, law of synchronicity. Law of attraction. So people say, You should sleep eight. Now I sleep six and I sleep like a baby. I don't need eight. So I get an extra two hours on what the rule is. Right. So what's that two hours times seven days a week? That's 14 hours a week, right? 14 hours a week. Times four is, what's that? 32 hours a month? It's more than that. 72 hours, whatever it is. But if you add it up over the whole year, I get an extra month by two hours because I don't sleep eight hours. I sleep six. Now, I'm not saying you shouldn't, you should sleep. Don't go with, that's why I said figure out for you. I figure it out for me. I was told if I didn't take my colon out, I would have, I would die of colon cancer. Right after my stomach surgery I was told I have to take all these drugs from my adhd. I didn't, cause I thought, Hmm, the ADHD medicine's methyl based. I'm an addict. I can't, I was told you should be on antidepressants when you, you know, after your stomach surgery. I don't, I don't like them. I don't make me feel good. I don't, I don't take, I do all these things and I come back to me and say, well, hold on. If it doesn't feel right for me, maybe I shouldn't do it. And I'm healed and healthy. Now, I'm not saying you don't listen to a doctor you can listen to, of course, but you've also gotta be, have your own barometer and navigating system. And intuitively you need to ask yourself, do I need this? Should I do some more research? You know, sit alone, like they say, if you sit alone in the dark, right, you shine in the bright lights, right? If you don't sit alone in the dark, you get exposed in the bright lights, and the bright lights are light. Do the work alone by yourself. When no one's around, shut everything off and sit alone. Ask yourself, how do I feel? Forget how do I feel? And tap into that and surrender to the unknown. And then the miracles happen. Deb: Love it. I, I, I like talking about time too, and because people are always trying to find more time, and one of the things I think, you know, for me getting sober, giving up drinking is magically I had so much more time because so much of your bandwidth is taken up with like thinking about drinking and then drinking and then recovering from drinking, and then, you know, just you just don't even realize it until it's gone. And then it's like, okay, now what do you do with that time? How do you feel, feel, fill your time? You know? How do you find meaning and purpose? And you're someone that seems like you're very driven by that. Do you have advice for people who now, let's say they're done with drinking, they have all this time on their hands, but they're kind of like, now what do I do? What do I do with my life? How do I figure this Mike: out? This is great. So I, someone asked me the other day, do I have any stress? I said, no. They're like, why? I said, I'll tell you why. Every morning, no matter where I travel in the world, cause I travel a lot with work, right? To do interventions and speaking is my rituals are the same. Wherever I land, I, if I have to adjust my clock a couple of hours, if I'm on the east coast, it's not three or four cause I'll lose three, maybe it's still five o'clock on the east coast, right? Cause I, I've gotta be smart. I've still gotta respect my body until I adjust every, I always get up. I drink 20, 30 ounces of water to hijack my body. I journal my thoughts, always journal my thoughts. How am I feeling in the morning? I do stretching, breath work and I work out, get those rituals out of the way. Okay? Everyone has an inclination. Everyone has a talent. Everyone has, whether they go after it or not, whether it's suppressed, we're all talented. God there, we all have a calling. The universe calls us, but it's a calling. It's not a conference call. It's an alone calling. Now, when we grow up, if the environment we are in doesn't allow us to thrive, guess what? We suppress our authentic calling. So that's why P you see people, they're like, I, I, I hate my job. I'm like, well, why do you have that job? Well, I've gotta pay my bills. I'm like, so you're surviving, right? So every job you go to after that is survival. It's not purpose driven because you've lost a sense of authentic self, right? So I tell people, go back in and say, what is something that a hobby I can do? Whether it's writing, whether it's singing, whether it's playing guitar, whether it's doing a spinning class, that if I couldn't fail, I would do it. And they're like, well, I would do this, this, and this. I'm like, perfect. That's your substitute. I want you to take a class on this. Don't try to be professional. Have fun. Enjoy it. And guess what you find? People actually find their purpose and their calling through the hobby because they, they don't beat themselves up, right? It's like you see kids. I was really good at sports and I, someone said to me today, my son started a T-ball and they said is, do you think he's gonna be as good an athlete as you? I said, I don't know. They're like, will you coach him? I said, Nope. I'm his parent. They're like, why? I'm like, he don't have to play sports. Like I had to play. I don't know what he, who he is. I'm gonna lean into his inclination. He likes math. I was horrible at math. He's great with people, which comes from me. He's definitely sporty like me, but he's no pressure. I don't know. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna lean into what he likes. If he wants baseball, we'll play baseball. If he doesn't like baseball, he wants to do track like I did. He'll do track if he likes painting, he will do painting if he likes the guitar. And so there, I tell people, find the hobby you love. Remove the inner critic. Have fun. Don't worry, just go join a class, join a spinning class, join a community, and guess what? All that time then starts to change you cuz you get involved in something, you have a little fun, you start to enjoy it, right? Because we take things too serious, right? Everyone's gotta be this and everyone's gotta be Why? Why go and have fun. So get a hobby, get a couple hobbies, and don't go in there with any expectations. Just go in there to enjoy them. Enjoy the moments, and then get a few friends that you can do them with. Build a little community, some like-minded people. If your friends are like, oh, you're too old to do that, cancel 'em out. Say, look, it's some of your business in my life. It's my life. Just let me do my thing and that, that's what I would do. Get some hobbies and have fun. Have a lot of fun. We we're all too serious. Don't take it serious. Don't take yourself serious. And Deb: do you think that naturally, you know, for those people you're talking about who are burnout or stressed out or hate their jobs, like, do you think that kind of having those other outlets, finding joy in other ways, it, it, it kind of transfers and trickles down to not just tolerating their job, but but being okay with it. You know, it's not your job's job to make you happy, right? Mike: No. It, I, look, I, this is what I tell people. There's a really famous, it will, will make a difference to your life. And I'll tell you why. So I now, my thing in life purpose to me is to inspire educator and motivate you, right? To bring you value. So I could go work in a Starbucks now and be okay with it. I don't care. So when I was a kid, I did all these jobs, which was great. I worked in grocery stores. I never forget, I was working in a grocery store once and this girl laughed at me. She goes, I can't believe you're doing this. I was like, I need to pay for my acting school cause no one's gonna pay for it. Now she's one of my biggest fans. I said, do you remember you gave me a hard time back in Perth? She goes, I never should have said that. So now I can. There was a great story about purpose and hobbies and fun, and there was these three guys working on a cathedral. And it's a fa you know, I write about it and I rewrite the story cuz I didn't like that. His mission was, I had a mission, I had a purpose to build a cathedral. No. If you are skilled as a carpenter, right, your purpose is to build things, to bring value to other people. I'm lucky, I'm skilled with people. I always had an innate ability to help people and care for them. It's not something I have to think about now. I was lucky that I could act and do these other things, but then I started to refine my skills as like I can help people find themselves cuz they can't see their talent. And I'm good at seeing other people's. So I focus on helping people find their purpose and talent. I don't have to think about it. I can look at someone and say, you're really good at this. I am. Yeah, you can't see it, but I can see it now. Apply these skills and you're gonna close the gap from where you are to where you wanna be. And I've always had that ability to, I've just good at it. It's not something I had to think about. I didn't want to coach people. People say, can you coach them? I don't want, I didn't want to inspire people. I just do things that inspire people. I just naturally get up. And if someone's down, I can lift them up. I'd have to think about it. I don't have to program myself to how many good D's do I do today? I just do good deeds just in my dna. N to be a good person. Now everyone try to corrupt it and beat it out. Me, oh, he's too positive. Ah, the world's not like that actually. The world can be like that. The world can be a nice place. You can be a good person. You don't have to be a dick. So if you find those hobbies and that community and you're in a job that you dislike, guess what? You are going to look at the job differently. You are going to figure out how you can be of service in that job. And you may then go, you don't what? I should take a night course or an online course or I've got, cuz what happens is when you do a hobby, the creative part of your brain starts exercising again. And then we think outside the box. And then you start to go, Hmm, you know, I never looked it like that. That's a good idea. And you get more engaged because at the end of the day, right, if I had to, if I lost everything, I'd just go get a job. I don't care. I'm lucky I get paid to do intervention that, but I've had to work as a janitor, like, oh, I'm just gonna clean some toilets. I don't, it doesn't bother me. It's just a job. It pays my bills. Do you know what I mean? Like, I don't, it's not, there's no status. It doesn't matter. At the end of the day, we all think it's. No one cares. No. You know what I mean? It's at the end. Like I said, tell the people how many. B, there's 2,650 billionaires in the world with a net worth of 112 trillion in Sonic, right? How is there a person starving? Seriously, all the money in the world, you don't take it with you When you die, get all these wealthy people and we stand on the edge of our grave and we face our creator. We can't take a toothbrush and her underwear with us. It didn't matter. My job is to help you find yourself and educate you with the mistakes I've made so you don't make 'em. It's about sharing. It's about abundance. It's about giving. It's about being kind. It's about being a good person. That's the job I sign up for every day, and I told someone I'm recession proof and not many people sign up for. He said what? I said, being a good human, really simple. Sign up for that job and you'll always have a job. You don't need any qualifications. Just be a good person. Bring value to others. So yeah, just if you find a hobby and just wherever you're at, it's okay. You're enough. It's okay. Just, just be where you're at. We've got nowhere to go. Where are we going? That, that, Deb: that makes me think of, you know, it's, it's not your circumstances that make you happy, like you may, and if you, you can see it in all over the world. You, you can see people in Haiti or refugee camps, you, you'll see the whole range of humans. And some are really miserable as you may expect. But also you'll find like really happy giving leaders all over the world no matter what their circumstances. So that always kind of makes me think of that. And then, as you were saying before, gratitude. So appreciating what you have now instead of striving for that next thing, striving for your next job or when you retire or when you get married or whatever that looks like for you. Mike: You never arrive. And that's why I say to people, Celebrate a win for 24 hours, suffer a loss for 24 hours. That's all we have. Even when I'm getting someone sober, right? And, and they're sober a day, and I'm like, we've got the same amount of sobriety. They're like, you've got 17 years. I said, no, I don't. We're both sober right now, right? And they're like, yeah. And I'm like, that's all that matters. And they're like, oh. I said, see the difference? Just get through the moments. 17 years is there's no past. I have this moment. You have this moment. We're both sober. That's all that matters. And that's what I slowed people down. I'm like, stop, stop, stop. Move. The numbers move. That's when people say, I don't have enough time. I'm like, well, where are you going? They're like, what? I'm like, you can do it now. Yeah, but I'm too old. Who said, you're too old. Too old for what? Like, just do it now. Just try. They're like, oh, I could, right? I'm like, you can not, could you? The only reason I succeed in anything I do is I don't quit and I stand in line long enough to get to the front. I just stand there. I'm not going anywhere. If I believe I can do it, I'm gonna do it. I don't listen to other people. I just go, how much work am I gonna have to do with the ability I have to refine my skills to achieve the goal? That's it. And I just keep chipping away and I just, I'm like the hair, not the tortoise. I just keep chipping away. I'm sorry, I'm the tortoise. I just like very slow. Right? Very slow. Chipping away and they're like, you keep going at it. I'm like, yeah. I enjoy it. I enjoy the process. If you can fall in love with the process, life is easy. Deb: Well, can you share more tips you have for people who are changing their Mike: drinking? Yeah, of course. So, alright, so first of all, do do a little thing. And I always tell. Give yourself 30 days, just say 30 days. No matter how I feel, I am going to substitute the alcohol for one empowering thing. Okay? Now, don't do what a lot of people do. Then after 30 days, go on a bender. Don't do that because then you just, you know, you'll feel, you'll feel horrible after 30 days. Ask yourself realistically how you feel. Just say, mm, how do I feel? Do I feel better? Okay, let's try another 30 and let's work out what? What other choice in or remember, substitute. Don't try and stop and quit. Just substitute instead of drinking, I'm just not gonna drink for the next 30 days. These are the things I'm gonna discipline myself to do. Now a lot of people get upset because I say, you know, it's about discipline. And a lot of people in the recovery world say it's not about discipline, it's not about willpower, but you have to be willing, right? There is still willpower in it. They say, yeah, but it's all about God. And I'm like, forget that. Just. Be willing to make a more empowering choice, just stop. You know what I mean? That's it. If you're ma, just what find five things that you could substitute. Call someone to share your points. If you need some kind of therapy or you need like an online group, if you don't have the money, find a group of like-minded people that no longer choose to drink. There's a lot of communities out there. They're not alcoholics. They're just like you know, sober people, right? Non-drinkers. Not even if it's a dry month, right? Do some kind of exercise. Some kind of movement. Movement. Boost the endorphins, the dopamine in our brain. You have to move your body sitting on the couch all day, watching bad tv, eating junk food. You're going to crave. Liquor doesn't work. Move the body. You don't have to run marathons. Just move it. Get up for 10 minutes. Go for a nice walk. Better to do it outside if you can in nature, cuz you'll feel more grounded and set it. If it's freezing cold, do it on a treadmill. Do something right. Eat clean foods. You've gotta eat clean foods. Eating processed junk foods only makes you crave more sugar. The most addictive thing in the world in our country is bread. Try one, you'll eat 10. Now you go to Europe, you have a croissant and you don't eat one 10 croissants cuz it's not full of sugar and processed junk. It's bad, right? Eat clean foods, right? Journal your thoughts. Journal, journal all your thoughts. Get the emotions out. If it's, if it's, if it's chaos here, it becomes clear here. Even if you have to get up every day and go, Mike Diamond is an asshole. I don't want to journal. I really dislike him. He's accent annoys me. I don't believe he gets up at three in the morning, blah, blah, blah. Even if you start that, I guarantee once you start writing about it, you'll feel better. So if you're anxious, what am I anxious about? I'm anxious cause of good answer it. What can I do? I'm craving. Great. What are you craving? I'm craving a drink. Now. Why? Why? There's gotta be a reason you're doing it. There's, why am I craving it? Why? Like, when people watch porn, like why are you watching it? Well, I just, no. Why do you need that stimulation? Why do you need to fill the void? Whatever the void is, right? So you got, then read something positive every day. Something uplifting. If you're struggling, read something that, like a really good biography. Just five, 10 minutes. Read it, physically read it because it'll inspire you. There's a lot of, you know what I mean? People will inspire, read my book. Right? You know what I'm saying? But people that have gone through setbacks, not cocky people that say they've got it all figured it out. Right? So there's four and then what's the last thing you could do? Oh, you know what's so huge and no, not many people stretch the body. You've gotta stretch the bo. I have pulled so much trauma. Out of my body in the last five years. Unbelievable. What sits in the body, in the cells. We don't stretch enough. You know, when you exercise, I don't exercise. For now, I exercise. So when I'm 80 years old, I can still outrun my son. I train for life, right? Do it now. So when you look at yourself and like, well, this, how will I be an 80? You don't wanna be crippled. You don't wanna be bent over. You want to be healthy, you want to be fit, you want to be strong, you want to be clear. So these rituals, if you do them, you should be able to do them for the rest of your life. So you're always clear, right? So you don't end up in a, an old people's home. You're not buckled over, right? So you're like, I feel good. I feel vibrant. I'm present. I, I've got a, I've got an auntie who's 85. Both my grandmothers lived to 102. Both of them, they outlived the men. By many years, the men were abusive to themselves. The alcoholism, which I got, the women 102. Wow. Yeah. They drank every now and then, but they live clean lights. Crazy. Right. 102. And they were of service the whole time. Both of them. And the men weren't. And they gave service to the church. Yeah. Deb: Yeah. I, I like the word stretch, you know? It could also be applied to like, your mind too. Stretch your body. Stretch your mind. Just, yeah. You Mike: know, the best thing about stretching, and I tell people this, think about this. I'm like, sit down, just sit down. Like, th I sleep really well. And someone goes, how? And I'm like, it's the easiest thing to do. They're like, wow. I'm like, all you do is lay there. They're like, yeah, but my mind, I said, no, I get everything out during the day. So I rest at night. I ne I sleep. Like even when I was a drug addict, I slept well. I never took Xanax because I get it all out during the day and then this is my time to recover. So I tell people, sit down for five minutes and do nothing, and close your eyes and watch how quickly the body and the mind tries to control you. Right? That's why Stretching's so important. If you sit down and you try to stretch the body out, think about it. We spend most of our time on these devices, right? We're broke, right? So we've gotta every 10, 20 minutes stretch the body, stretch the hamstrings, open up the chakras, get the breathing right. We, we we're falling apart because we don't stretch. And if we don't stretch and lift a little weight, what happens? We get atrophy. So stretching is one of them. And I never stretch as a kid, as an athlete, I was so bound up. And all the stuff in your sympathetic nervous system stays in your body. It's bad, especially men. All our anger stays in our groins and our lower chakras sexual frustration and our lower back. Bad stuff. We've gotta stretch that out and pull it out, you know, it's important. Stretching's, one of the most important things, change my life. Stretching really been incredible. Deb: Well, I appreciate that. I like hearing the, to me that's like an out of the box tool, like I wouldn't have thought of. So, cool. Thank you. Well, thank you for sharing all of this. I, I think, of course you all should check out A Dose of Positivity by Mike Diamond. What else are you up to? What's what? Where can we find you? What are you doing? Mike: I know the, the TV show intervention with a and e I actually go, I'm starting, I shot my first episode the other day. I'm actually gonna be one of the regulars doing interventions on that so they can catch me on Netflix, ice tv, and a and e. I'll be like, I'm always on Instagram doing a lot of speaking gigs, a lot of coaching. And then over the next few years, I mean, my third book's written, so that'll be. I'll be trying to, yeah. And my fourth book's written, I'm, I'm two books ahead. Like that's how, how bad my 88, that's what happens when you get sober and you get up at three in the morning. I get you get a lot of shit done. I get so much done. Like I get so much done. Like I am so, like, I just, I have so much time, but it's, it's quality time cuz All was doing before is blowing up my life just doing crazy. Bill. He just waste so much time trying to do, look, the, the, this is what everyone has to remember and I think it was Bill Gates that, not Bill Gates Steve Jobs that said it, he was worth like 7 billion when he died. He died young in his fifties, early fifties. And he said it doesn't matter if it's a $3,000 apartment or a 3 million apartment, if you're alone in the space, you're alone in. So the point is it's not what we accumulate, it's not all these things. And it's just slowly, like if someone would've told me this book, when I wrote it, started writing at the beginning of the pandemic literally three years ago. It the, what I've gone through, I had got Covid three times when I was writing it and shingles and had mul. Yeah, right. Multiple stomach infections from the covid for my stomach. And now that it's coming out, it's like, like what are your expectations? Like I have no expectations and that's, I'm not supposed to have expectations. I'm supposed to be of service. But before when I started writing it, it's like in your ego's like, I'm gonna get this done. Cuz Covid made everyone panic, right? I've gotta get this done. I've gotta be quicker, I've gotta just, cause I lost all these speaking gigs and this, now I'm just like, ah. Just day by day it humbles you. Slow down. You're enough. Chill out. It's okay. Figure out the small stuff. Just a little chip away every day. Just a little bit. Just, just, just, just, and be kind. Just be kind. You know? I do this thing once a week. I was telling someone and I go around my grocery store and I every week and I just, I always, I don't post about it. I see someone that I know struggling. I can see them. I can just see, you know, I'm, I'm good with people and I'll just walk up to them, how's your day going? And they're like, Ugh, honestly. I'm like, yeah. And they're like, it's horrible. Okay. And I'm like, you know, when was the last time someone did something kind for you? And they're like, I don't remember. I'm like, great. Well I'm gonna buy you groceries. And they're like, what? And I know most people live check by check now. And the pandemic's been hard. I don't live check by check, I never have. And I buy the groceries. And they're like, I can't believe you did that. And I'm like, the reason I'm doing it is I want you to remember that there are kind people in the world now. What I want you to do is be kind of the next person you see. Now, if I buy one person's groceries every week, right? That's 52 weeks in a year. I didn't touch 52 people. I touched every person that they touch, right? So they'll, they'll drive down the street and instead of cutting someone off or that person cuts them off, they just smile at them like, ah, they're probably having a rough day, right? They don't go into the, the grocery store next time and it says 15 items or less, like, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. I wanna kill that person. They've got 20 items, right? So despite doing one kind act to one person back of their mind, it makes them go, wait, you know what? There is some hope. Maybe I go help the next person, and then, then I help with the next person. So, the compound effect of doing one ni, one nice gesture a week to one person over 20 years, that's a lot of work just by helping one person once a week. That's what people need to do. Yeah, Deb: that, that's lovely. Thank you. Well, I wanna thank you so much for being on the show and sharing all your wisdom. I look forward to your future books and everything else you're putting out there. All this good kindness in the world. So thanks. Mike: Thank you for having me. It's been awesome. Where were you actually located? I'm in Deb: Boise, Idaho. Mike: Oh, okay. Are you in California? I'm in la yeah. But so many people from LA go to go to Idaho now. We have a lot Deb: of Californian. It's kind of a thing like people who move here from California don't tell people they're from, they're like, I'm from California. Cause there's so many who move up here. Cause it's just such like a great place , I mean, it's just you know, we get four seasons and just, it's beautiful in the mountains, lakes, river. It's less traffic. Yeah. It's amazing. Have you been out here? Mike: I haven't. I have to make a trip. I, I, I miss the seasons. Even though now in LA we're getting a lot of rain. Cause I lived in New York 10 years and I like, oh yeah, I like the cold. I love the cold. Cause I didn't grow up with the cold in Australia. Yeah. Yeah. I like the snow. I like the wet. I, it makes you feel good. You isolate. You have to be creative. Can't just always be sunny. It doesn't work like that. You need the balance. Well, Deb: yeah. And I think just seeing. The changes and living through 'em, like, it's such a good metaphor for life. Like we do go through all these changes and life, like you said, it, it's 50 50 and sometimes our trees are bare and sometimes they're budding and they're full and they're, yeah. So I Mike: love it. Go through it. You suppose, I'll leave you with this. This will help anyone struggling. And it's really important. So a really famous athlete was talking to her coach one day. It was beautiful. I never looked it like this. And, and she said, I just feel like crap today. And, and she was an Olympic athlete, right? You're like an Olympic, how could you feel like I didn't put, that's like, how could you feel like crap? And he said, good. And she's like, good. What do you mean good? She didn't expect that. He goes, I'm gonna teach you a trick that'll change your life. He goes, it's the rule of thirds. You're supposed to feel like crap. You're supposed to feel good, and you're supposed to feel no, you're supposed to feel like crap. You're supposed to feel okay and you're supposed to feel good. Don't wanna feel great, just feel good. Don't feel too good all the time. Don't feel okay all the time. Don't feel crap all the time. Right. Crap. You need to do something to balance it. So there's always a rule of third. So if you get up and you're having a crappy day, it's the rule of third. It's gonna be okay. You're gonna feel okay. Eventually. You're gonna feel good. Don't stress it out. Deb: Love it, love it. What a wonderful way to end it. So thank you. Thank you so much.